Posts by NoNonsense

    The way I see it, people are just really greedy.


    They just want Success, Success, Success...

    How did you come to a thread where people complain that they had up to 80 failed attempts in a row to enhance their items, and conclude that they are greedy? So a person feels bad about spending around $40 on a game without getting anything in return, and they are the ones who are greedy?


    I also felt a long time ago that players are overcharging for their items, and for sure, some still do. But now I understand it much better.


    Take bracelets for example. If you want to get it by yourself, you are going to have to do hundreds and hundreds of KQs, and there is still no guarantee that you will get it. And then, if you want to enhance it to the max level, you are going to need a lot of real life money. So what do you think is the fair price for this item when you finally decide to sell it?


    And you do need these items, unless you have a group of friends to do everything together whenever you want. And even then, at least some people from that group will need them.

    The Jumping Lord

    I remember a long time ago there was a patch that stated that the enhancement system was improved in a way that if you have a lot of fails in a row, the success rate will go up. For that to work, you supposedly have to keep the enhancement window open.


    However, after how many fails will this supposedly improved success rate be triggered, and what that new success is going to be will never be disclosed. For all we know, it could very well be like this: if the success rate is, say, 1%, you will need roughly 100 attempts to get a success; with this new "improved" system, after 99 failed attempts, the next attempt will 100% be a success. Big improvement.


    So, the players want the enhancement system to be improved and become more fair and balanced. Do they get it? No! Instead the blame for failed enhancement is put on them. You had many failed attempts. Did you close the enhancement window? Well, there's ya problem! Did you enhance when many other players were also enhancing? Tsk, tsk, tsk, big mistake.


    Even if these reasons for failed enhancements were true, which I highly doubt, they are absolutely unacceptable, because it is not explained anywhere in the game while you try to enhance.


    So, why is it all so vague and hush-hush? I really wonder.

    Just for the sake of truth, enhancing a T3 weapon to +12 will routinely take 5-6 full bundles, and that is after you spend 30 or 40+ elrues trying to get it to +3.


    And I don't really understand why it would be natural for the success rate to go down with higher tiers. Those higher tier bundles already cost way more. For example, T5 bundles are more than 100% more expensive than T3 bundles. Therefore, the success rates should be exactly the same. Or make the prices of bundles the same, and then play with the success rates. You shouldn't do both.


    And bracelets are even worse. That is, if you can even get one. Because after doing well over 200 KQs, I am yet to find a single defender bracelet.

    I love this game. I really do. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that I have spent more time playing this game than all other games combined. I have definitely spent more money on it than on all other games combined.


    One thing I don't understand though, why does Gamigo make it so hard for players to enjoy the game and to have fun and enjoyable experience playing it?


    Let me illustrate this by just 3 points:


    1) Enhancement. Now, I'm not going to talk about how expensive enhancement is, although spending the equivalent of two AAA titles to get your character fully enhanced is quite honestly ridiculous. What is even worse is the whole experience of enhancing.


    For example, you want to enhance your grade 3 weapon to +12. You apply a very simple strategy, these items will not break until +4, so you don't start using bundles until you get to +4. Simple, right? However, you will find that even though +4 will give a very small, almost insignificant boost, getting there without using bundles is virtually impossible, because the chance of downgrade is extremely high.


    So after 40+ attempts, you realize it's not working, and you start using the premium item to prevent your weapon from downgrading. Then, you realize that from +3,+4 to +12 you are going to need at least 4 bundles, more likely 5, and possibly even 6. Which means that you are going to spend more than 20 euros to enhance your weapon, and then have to sit through 80-100 attempts before your weapon is fully enhanced. In the process, you are going to see that you are going to waste one, two, or even three bundles without getting a single +. It will most likely happen at +11. So, you just spent 10+ euros and you didn't get anything? Oops!


    Of course, this means that you are going to be extremely selective with the items you decide to enhance, or even stop doing it altogether, because the experience is so frustrating that instead of feeling happy that you have a shiny new weapon, you feel exhausted and cheated.


    And enhancement nowadays isn't even going to make you feel special in any way, it's not a privilege, it's a necessity.


    2) Binding. Wow, this one is bad. Sure, there is a premium item that is used to unbind, but literally the only purpose of this feature is to extract more money from the players. So, after spending 100+ euros to enhance my character, I'm now supposed to spend additional 30+ euros in order to sell the items once I'm done with them? And, yeah, this probably makes some money, but I am absolutely sure that it loses much more, because this is a deal breaker for many, many players.


    I, for one, am sure I'm never touching any of those items, no matter how addicted I am to the game. Which means that equipping my characters at high levels is going to be very difficult, and maybe even impossible.


    3) Drops. Getting something good in a game like this should feel rewarding, earned, not easy. I agree with that. However, this game often takes it too far.


    I have levelled up my character from 90-100 by doing only HRW for a chance to get the defender bracelet. That is literally 200+ KQs. And I have received 1 sentinel bracelet. That's it!? Seriously!?


    I have done hundreds and hundreds of runs in the tower of iyzel for a chance of obtaining a good 45 archer set. To be honest, I got very nice pants, but not even decent armor and boots. Finding a decent hat or helmet after killing thousands and thousands of mobs? Good luck with that.


    There are many more examples like this, but the point is, why do you make it so hard for players to enjoy the game and to keep supporting it? Why not be just a little bit more generous with your players, because I'm sure that we would be more than happy to reciprocate.

    SittingPretty

    I understand that there might be some issues with the coding, but a good programmer should be able to resolve it. After all, they have done a similar thing when the merge happened, right?


    The question is whether it is worth the effort, and I really think that it is. It would provide an incentive for people to be more active on less populated servers, and would most likely make people come back to the game.


    Otherwise, why would they focus on the mailbox? To make it possible for players to send messages to their friends and others why they are offline? It doesn't seem worthy enough to make it a priority.


    Kentomaru

    Unfortunately, it often seems like Fiesta has come to a point where almost all good ideas get dismissed too easily, for whatever reason. Maybe all games come to that point, but I still think that Fiesta Online has a lot of potential, and that it could still be great. They just need to listen to the community more, and be more open to their suggestions.

    So, some time ago Gamigo tried to introduce the mailbox system to the game, and almost immediately removed it due to some issues that it was causing. Then, they mentioned that they are going to work on it some more, and it is actually one of three priorities that they listed for the next period.


    At first, I was thinking that there is no point to add this, as there are other modes of communication for players, both in-game and out, that are widely accepted and more fluid and smooth.


    But then it dawned on me, you should be able to use this system to attach items and send it to other people, right?


    And not only that - you could also make this system cross-server, so it would be possible for example to farm items on Pagel and send them to your character on Isya to sell it. Or you could send items from Isya to your characters on Pagel so they could have an easier time leveling up.


    This would help make all servers much more active, as it would offer a chance to people who prefer to play on a less crowded server to enjoy the game without feeling like they and their items are stuck on a ghost server.


    Do you guys think that Gamigo is going to implement it this way? Have they mentioned it anywhere? What do you think about it?

    yengaphiwatbryden

    I understand what you mean. But in your example, the first case would mean that you need 1500-3000 kills to gain a level, and in the second you would need 600-1000. So it would also mean a much faster levelling rate.


    And don't get me wrong, I am all for faster levelling, especially because I am painfully slow at it.


    But, killing the same mob over and over so you can get to a higher level where you are again going to kill a different mob over and over isn't going to be particularly appealing, no matter how you frame it.


    Therefore, I think that it would be better to have a system that moves away from repeats, and instead offers good and rewarding regular quests, dailies, challenges, KQs, dungeons, etc. It would be much more fun.

    Most likely that grey pillar didn't spawn at all, because I was touching everything I could get my hands on.


    Hmm, that came out wrong slimeblush


    It isn't such a huge problem if it doesn't go into your permanent record, or something like that. But it is very annoying to get jailed for something that isn't really your fault.


    And, seriously, the disconnect issues need to be resolved already. This is the only game I play where I regularly get disconnected, at least several times every day. It can happen at gates, when I try to get into KQs, when I try to transport somewhere using scrolls, or just randomly as I am standing on a map, vending, checking the stores... It completely destroys the flow of game play, especially since sometimes it takes multiple attempts to get back to the game.

    Your suggestion is okay for people who do repeats with a party. It would be fast and probably feel more rewarding. However, for people who solo most of the time, it would be horrible. Imagine how demotivating it would be for a cleric to see that they need, say, 100 kills for something like 3-4%. At least when you need 30 kills, and you get 1-2% per turn in, you can do it once or twice before going completely crazy.

    MintyGreens I touched every pillar I found, and multiple times, but still nothing spawned.


    Yeng You are right that it might be due to code, but I think it was because of the roars, and some overzealous GM started punishing people without looking into it first. Because, I was inactive for maybe 2-3 minutes, after exhausting every chance of mobs spawning, and it shouldn't be enough to trigger the system, right?


    I'm really unsure of what happened, but I am kinda scared now to go back to the KQ. What happens if you get sent to prison multiple times? Can you get permanently banned?

    You know how it happens frequently that when you register for a Kingdom Quest, just as you are about to get transported to it, at the loading screen, poof, you get disconnected? And often it doesn't happen to you only, but to multiple people at the same time. So instead of having 20 people, say, only 13 get in.


    Well, it happened today while I was doing Sorah's Catacomb. Only 5 people were able to get in, the rest got disconnected. However, one person didn't realize that, and thought that they were leeching, so he started roaring about it.


    Now, I'm not very familiar with this particular KQ, but I think you are supposed to touch crystals, kill the mobs, use the drops to touch crystals again until they are all standing, something like that. Anyway, for some reason, no mobs appear at all, so we are just standing there, waiting for the timer to pass.


    And then, out of nowhere, I get sent to a prison for two hours. Reason? Being AFK while in KQ. Hehe, fun times.


    Okay, okay, maybe the story wasn't so funny, but still wanted to share. Maybe someone will find a moral to this story, because it seems fleeting to me.

    I agree with you. At least 20% of the time it happens that I get DC at the loading screen as I am about to get transferred to a KQ. And when I'm back in the game, the KQ has started, but I am in a city. And I can see on the list of players who got in that it happened to others as well. You can see empty spaces between commas, which indicate all the players who got DC as well. I once saw only 7 out of 20 people actually got in.


    It is extremely annoying and should be fixed.

    I think that the main problem here is that SC items have such a big effect on the game, that they throw pretty much any serious talk about balancing the classes right out of window. 100% charms alone double the defense that you have. So if a gladiator charms, how much would you then have to reduce their defense (which I don't agree with at all, even though I don't have a gladiator) to make it hard for them to efficiently tank?

    Zao

    I was curious, and wanted to check how these items actually changed the success you had with enhancing. Now, because Gamigo would probably never reveal the actual numbers, I had to build a scenario based on a number of assumptions that come as a result of my own experience with enhancing, as well as experiences of some other players.


    It is pretty obvious, and logical, that you have a higher chance of success when enhancing from +3 to +4 than when you enhance from +11 to +12. I took this into account. My estimate of the percentages, which might be quite off, will still serve its purpose of showing the effect the Super Enhancement Bundle will have on the number of attempts one would make. The assumption is that you start using SC bundles when you get to +3. So, this is my estimate:


    Levels

    Base Success Rate

    Regular Enhancement Bundle (+15%)

    Super Enhancement Bundle (+20%)

    3-6

    40%

    46%

    48%

    6-9

    20%

    23%

    24%

    9-11

    10%

    11.5%

    12%

    11-12

    5%

    5.75%

    6%


    Then, using these numbers, I wanted to see how many attempts I would need using the regular bundle to get my weapon to +12. Strangely enough, the result I got was 54, which is exactly the number I needed in my real life situation (Although this is probably just a coincidence). If I use the Super Bundle, the number would go down to 52, shaving off two tries, which is really not a lot.


    However, you are right; these numbers need to be bigger in order to see the full effect of this improved success rate. Therefore, I imagined a scenario where I wanted to enhance all ten of my items to the max. Here, I made an assumption that the success rates remain consistent for items that you enhance to +9 and +10. These were the results I got:



    Regular Enhancement Bundle

    Super Enhancement Bundle

    No. of attempts

    274

    262


    In this simulated case, I was able to shave off 12 attempts, or just a bit more than one bundle. In other words, this is like the game is saying: ²If you buy 28 bundles, we will make 1 of those bundles free for you. Whaddaya say?“


    Now, with the discount that we had, how much am I actually saving? Lets see:


    With the regular Grade 4 bundle, I needed almost 28 bundles at the price of 7,719sc, for a total of 216,132sc.


    With the Super bundle, I needed to get 27 bundles at the price of 6,174sc, for a total of 166,698sc.


    This means that I saved almost 50k sc, which in percentages means that i got a 22.87% discount. That is not bad, although I would prefer something closer to 35%.


    However, if I buy the Super Bundle at its normal price, I am in big trouble. I would need 27 bundles priced at 9,498sc, for a total of 256,446sc. Yikes! I just spent 40k sc more than i would with the good ol regular bundle, for the same result. But hey, I saved myself one bundle and some extra.


    My point is, please don¢t release the super bundle at its normal price, it is a total rip-off.


    Full disclosure, I am not a mathematician, or anything like that. It is possible that my numbers are not fully accurate, or that some of my assumptions are wrong. But I am pretty sure that even if that were the case, my conclusions are still very much accurate, and they would survive a more scientific testing and scrutiny.


    Sorry for the lengthy post everyone.

    Zao

    It wouldn't make a difference to me if you offered super enhancement bundle outside of a sale because I don't think that extra 5% success chance means anything.


    I wanted to start a topic on enhancement rates, to see what the community thinks about it, but I can share my experience enhancing one item here, just to illustrate my point.


    So, I'm enhancing a grade 3 weapon. I know it can't break until +4, but I am only able to get it to +3 after literally 40+ attempts. So, at +3 I decide to use SC bundles. First bundle gets me to +8, let's say it's 50% success rate. Second bundle gets me to +10, down to 20% success rate. Third bundle gets me to +11, only 10% success rate. Fourth and fifth bundle yield no success at all, nothing. I get my sixth bundle, and on the fourth attempt, finally, I get my item to +12. I used a total of 54 attempts to get from +3 to +12, and I had 30 consecutive fails.


    Now, in total I needed 54 attempts to get 9 successes, meaning less than 20% success rate. But, let's say it's 20%, just for the sake of round numbers and easier calculations. What would extra 5% mean to me? It wouldn't get my 20% to 25%, which would be meaningful. It would actually get it to 21% only. And what would it do at those high levels, getting it to +12, where it seems like the success rate can go below 5%? It would bump it to 5.1%? Simply not worth it at all.


    This is why I consider it just a sales gimmick, where you assign an arbitrary number for an arbitrary increase to the success rate, so you can then drop the price and present it as a much bigger discount (or win-win as you said) than it actually is.

    Zao

    If I understand correctly, the regular enhancement bundle grade 4 costs 7,719sc and it contains an item that improves your success chances by 15%. This super enhancement bundle comes with a 20% improved success chance, and is "normally" priced at 9,498. This is for a 5% extra success rate, which I'm pretty sure is impossible for a regular player to even notice. The difference in price however is pretty significant, which would explain why this "super" item is at the store at a normal price only from time to time, as you have mentioned, because it's not such a great deal, honestly.


    But, I understand that 35% off sounds much better than, say, 15 or 20% off, and that this is probably a legitimate sales tactic, even if people might find it deceitful or think of it as false advertising.

    Zao

    That doesn't really respond my question. Can I ever buy that item at the normal price point? Or that price point only shows up when the item is discounted, making it completely arbitrary, thus making the discount also completely arbitrary? Which is what I assume the OP was referring to.

    Aerro

    You are totally right! I had to check because I wasn't paying attention before to what mats were dropping, and really, there it is, Spirit's Nectar lq. Everything else is highest quality, and only this one is low. And it only drops when I don't get a set piece. It means it's either broken, or the game is trolling us hard :)


    Either way, they ought to take a look at this. And if there is a chance to obtain some rare items such as lvl 60 jewelries, they should increase the drop rate, even just a little bit. That would make farming the tower much more interesting.

    Thanks for the replies, it's really helpful to learn more about the game :)


    SittingPretty

    I have too many questions, it would probably take pages :) That's why I was thinking about a list of drops, and if there isn't one, maybe it would be a good idea to create it. Just don't know where to start with that.


    Aerro

    So, Lost Mini Dragon HC is the only place where you can acquire lvl60 jewelries? Tower of Iyzel only gives lvl45 set pieces and cards? And some greens, but they don't count :)