End Game Guardian Viability?

  • I kind of want to go ham on heals and be full support, but I want to also be useful. Are there any instances at end game in which you actually prefer to have a guardian with you? Or is it just HK only? I know HK's bring awesome utility in the form of buffs, etc (and I already have one), but I really would just like to try guardian out. I just don't want to level really far up to find out people are going to fill up with HK's and sit you out. Thanks for any insight! <3

  • Level a hk and guard :love:

    kVJtqk7.png

    。.。:∞♡*♥ 115 Wiz - 135 SS - 135 Guard - 135 WL - 135 Glad - 135 HK ♥*♡∞:。.。

    looking for sc bonus...

  • Oh wait nvm i missed the part where you said you already have a hk. Guards are nice for pvp? But it's kind of dead, theres basically no wars in fbz anymore. For instances people usually wont mind having a guard. Normally 1 hk/1guard? or 2 hks, or whichever they can find.

    kVJtqk7.png

    。.。:∞♡*♥ 115 Wiz - 135 SS - 135 Guard - 135 WL - 135 Glad - 135 HK ♥*♡∞:。.。

    looking for sc bonus...

  • HolyKnight is superior in all aspects because:

    God's Benevolence is Expo-wide which is damage boost.
    Deadly Blessing is 100% Crit for 13 seconds (With 2-piece 135 Gear) which is damage boost.

    Bash which provides defense decrease debuff on the enemy which is a damage boost.
    Protect which provides increases damage/defense which is a damage boost.


    Guardian's only real benefit is the bubble and increased heals.
    As Gladiators, we do more damage with our HP being lower. So a HolyKnight will always be preferred over a Guardian.
    Guardian needs more raid utility to even be considered for anything besides PVP.

    Current Guild Master of OneWingedAngels Guild.
    Current Raid Leader of the Alliance.
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    xRei - Lvl 135 Warlock
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  • I'm a guardian at heart and always will be, but HK is definitely at advantage in the current game due to several skills that render the guard kind of useless. HK has basically no real weakness rn because of the buggy empowerment of the cross (1 cross = roughly 40k HP for each party member at full empowerment) and the guardian having no equally powerful skill. Although guard heals (single target) are still the strongest, that's really all there is to the class, which is very sad and doesn't make a big difference because HK's single heals may be weaker but they're still enough.

    I'd still suggest, if you have the time, to go for a second cleric and make him a guardian. They're both worth playing after all if you love cleric in general.

    »It's the nature of time that the old ways must give in.«

    rYUKWHa.gif

    Alle Wege führ'n nach Rom und irgendwann zurück nach Köln.

  • They need to rework a lot of things for Guardian.
    Rebirth can be changed to work exactly like a Tear of Legal for example.
    The Bubble can provide more protection and for longer.
    And possibly implement something Guardians contribute to Raids, whether it's a lot of healing, or a lot of protection.

    Current Guild Master of OneWingedAngels Guild.
    Current Raid Leader of the Alliance.
    Current IQ: 203 (and counting!)
    -
    xRei - Lvl 135 Warlock
    yRei - Lvl 135 Reaper
    zRei - Lvl 135 Gladiator
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    Add me on Discord and ask me anything Fiesta related:
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  • Before they buff the guard they need to nerf the HK. No, they need to fix the HK. And they should begin with the cross, that would be a huge help already. Especially the healrate...it's not supposed to heal that much. And not only that, its duration is buggy as well. Currently it's twice as long as it's supposed to be (30 sec instead of 15) and has no downtime. Compared to that the bubble is ridiculous.

    Once that's fixed they can think about making the rezzbuff more useful and maybe more.

    »It's the nature of time that the old ways must give in.«

    rYUKWHa.gif

    Alle Wege führ'n nach Rom und irgendwann zurück nach Köln.

  • Before they buff the guard they need to nerf the HK. No, they need to fix the HK. And they should begin with the cross, that would be a huge help already. Especially the healrate...it's not supposed to heal that much. And not only that, its duration is buggy as well. Currently it's twice as long as it's supposed to be (30 sec instead of 15) and has no downtime. Compared to that the bubble is ridiculous.

    Once that's fixed they can think about making the rezzbuff more useful and maybe more.

    Why nerf HK? As an HK I do not find the cross to be overpowered. You can barely keep it perm up if you empower the cool down. It also does not overly heal, it is like just right for the heals.

    But I do think guardians are the broken class. Their bubbles has been broken since the beginning and that truly needs to be fixed. I also think their rebirth should act like tears of legal, bring back the dead's buffs/scrolls and such.

    And in order classes should always be buffed first to bring them comparatively to the other class, rather than weaken the more balanced of the two, because honestly this just makes it sound like "HK have it too good, they should be ruined just like guard" rather than "HK seem too OP but I wonder if guardians were not broken would they be more comparable to each other"

  • Why nerf HK? As an HK I do not find the cross to be overpowered. You can barely keep it perm up if you empower the cool down. It also does not overly heal, it is like just right for the heals.

    But I do think guardians are the broken class. Their bubbles has been broken since the beginning and that truly needs to be fixed. I also think their rebirth should act like tears of legal, bring back the dead's buffs/scrolls and such.

    And in order classes should always be buffed first to bring them comparatively to the other class, rather than weaken the more balanced of the two, because honestly this just makes it sound like "HK have it too good, they should be ruined just like guard" rather than "HK seem too OP but I wonder if guardians were not broken would they be more comparable to each other"

    Thank you Minty! I keep on and on saying this too! :)

  • Then we have a big difference between NA and EU here. In the EU version HKs are able to empower the cross heal so much that it heals 1k HP in less than a second with a duration of 30 secs. I'll do the math for you, that's almost 40k HP per cross for each party member (I already mentioned this before). If it's not the same in NA then this can't be compared so feel free to ignore it, but if it's the same in your version then I have to heavily disagree with you because this is not balanced at all and it can't be helped with buffing the guard because we're talking about bugs here that need to be fixed.

    Again, if it's different in your version please ignore this but in EU the HK is helplessly overpowered, without discussion. They currently have everything: stronger buffs, damage boosts, useful debuffs on almost all their damage skills and a permanently available superheal that eradicates their weakness because their baby heals are more than enough to cover what the cross can't heal. Meanwhile the guard has: stronger heals and a bubble that's fairly useless as it is. Same goes for the rezzbuff. That's it.

    If you just go and buff classes so they can keep up with their partner class you risk going into extremes. Which is not even necessary in case of the cleric because back when the HK wasn't op the balancing between HK and guard was perfectly fine. Guardian wouldn't need a buff if HK wasn't buggy as heck because the idea behind both classes is fine and has worked well in the past without needing empowerment.

    In the German forums I did a comparison for the cross and bubble and I was shocked myself when I saw the numbers. It's just terribly broken.


    Btw I don't want to bring HK down as I do love the class as well, I've played both cleric classes a lot. Imho HK is the broken class mainly due to bugs and I want that to be fixed.

    »It's the nature of time that the old ways must give in.«

    rYUKWHa.gif

    Alle Wege führ'n nach Rom und irgendwann zurück nach Köln.

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Ladany ().


  • Cross is overpowered when empowered, it's not supposed to heal that much per second.
    SittingPretty doesn't seem like they understand what's going on with with Cross as it seems they are fully relying on Cross heals to heal the entire group rather than member switching and weaving their healing abilities.

    Not to mention, Cross also provides A LOT of damage boost to the entire expo.
    Not to mention, Deadly Blessing is superior than anything a Guardian can provide. Period.

    Current Guild Master of OneWingedAngels Guild.
    Current Raid Leader of the Alliance.
    Current IQ: 203 (and counting!)
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    xRei - Lvl 135 Warlock
    yRei - Lvl 135 Reaper
    zRei - Lvl 135 Gladiator
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    Add me on Discord and ask me anything Fiesta related:
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  • Actually I prefer to switch between people to heal. Try playing with me sometime before you make such assumptions please! I rarely use the cross skill personally. I find that I am better off healing individuals based on their hp needs rather than just going "oh here, pt heal, job done".

    Doesn't mean that I don't observe others game play styles though, or see the flaws/merits of skills even if I don't necessarily use them.

  • I rarely use the cross skill personally.


    Why would anyone farm with you if you rarely use cross? It's a huge damage boost.

    Current Guild Master of OneWingedAngels Guild.
    Current Raid Leader of the Alliance.
    Current IQ: 203 (and counting!)
    -
    xRei - Lvl 135 Warlock
    yRei - Lvl 135 Reaper
    zRei - Lvl 135 Gladiator
    -
    Add me on Discord and ask me anything Fiesta related:
    Rei#9999

  • I also think their rebirth should act like tears of legal, bring back the dead's buffs/scrolls and such.

    yes. :love:

    kVJtqk7.png

    。.。:∞♡*♥ 115 Wiz - 135 SS - 135 Guard - 135 WL - 135 Glad - 135 HK ♥*♡∞:。.。

    looking for sc bonus...

  • Gamigo actively changed the cross recently the update is listed in the patch notes.


    For me this indicates gamigo intended for it to be the way it is now. If they were going to fix it they would have when they were changing the skill.


    Evidence below. So no I don’t think the HK skill is bugged the in game description needs updating that’s all.




    xfJl9KI.png


    Invigorate Invigorate

    • Increased movement speed


    Bash Bash

    • Starting at skill level 13, the skill 'Bash' will add a stackable debuff to your enemy's defense


    njFtcz4.png Bleed

    • Starting at skill level 8, the skill 'Bleed' adds a 4-second bleed effect to your target


    Mighty Chop Mighty Chop

    • Starting at skill level 3, the skill 'Mighty Chop' adds a 1.5 second root effect to the target


    GOd's Benevolence God's Benevolence

    • The healing effect has been lowered slightly
    • The healing duration has been increased from 15 to 30 seconds
  • Thanks for sharing, I didn't know this because I wasn't playing actively at that time. What a shame.

    I'm a little stunned right now that they would willingly patch something like that into the game and I'm slowly giving up. They seem to hate guards, there's no other explanation I can think of when I see this. Bug or not, this is killing the balancing.


    EDIT: The empowerment of the cross heal is still buggy though. Years ago I asked a gamigo official about that and he told me that it's a bug, the empowerment is supposed to affect the small damage the cross inflicts, not the heal. Though the fact that they have known about this for a looong time without fixing it is telling of their bias. I'm in the mood to delete my guards rn. I'm just so done.

    »It's the nature of time that the old ways must give in.«

    rYUKWHa.gif

    Alle Wege führ'n nach Rom und irgendwann zurück nach Köln.

    The post was edited 2 times, last by Ladany ().