Gladiators are destroying the game

  • lyff, ROSE online (literal FS heal/buff bots), Tera (not really, but mostly), Rift

    in TERA, the healer is at the party as something main, and tank, then there is the DPS, in Fiesta Online you don't need a healer / knight

  • One of the top MMOs that recently released it's first support class which is primarily pvp focused game yet this new class is the worst when it comes to pvp.

    It function well on it's on in PvE however.


    It will get purged if i stated the game's name but you can google the above and you should be able to find it. Also guess what? Nobody complained in that game that a class cannot pvp in a pvp focus game.

  • Also guess what? Nobody complained in that game that a class cannot pvp in a pvp focus game.

    1. The game wasn't originally intended to have trinity. Don't play it so no idea why they decided to add a dedicated support character now. Maybe because the company is notorious for listening to bad player QQ.
    2. Due to lack of trinity (and quite a few other reasons) it doesn't really compare to a game with clear-cut class structures like Fiesta.
    3. Considering the life arch of the game, they have plenty of time to adjust this fresh class. And they will, because of what was said in 1., and because they actually do that. They improve the game.
    4. Additionally, oddly enough when googling, I found plenty of complaints about this, even on official forums.

    To be completely honest, PvP balance isn't and shouldn't be main focus with Fiesta. It was, is, and always will be a tank'n'spank PvE game with a little casual PvP on the side, and no amount of tryharding PvP-focused people will change that. So as far as rebalancing things goes, that's where the focus should be on. Figure out PvP content on top of that after it's done.

    I think the reason people point out the way other games do supports in PvP is just to underline how far below Fiesta is on this matter. Ie. in many other games of the same main characteristics, supports can CHOOSE to sacrifice this or that aspect of their class to be great in PvP over PvE, party or solo. In Fiesta this exists slightly in form of free stats, but that's not enough considering all impacting variables. As a result they can't really be great or useful in either PvE OR PvP.

    The problem is they can't excel in anything. Even things they were intended for.

  • What makes you think support classes are bad? Actually they have a neat advantage even in that game.

    Also, why should a support class be able to drop other classes in PvP? That wouldn't really make them supportive more like frontliners.


    Moreover, clerics are more unkillable than knights, I think that needs a serious nerf. There shouldn't be anything as tanky or better than knights. Even the average player with broken gladiator class struggle at times against clerics.


    To your last point, most changes face criticism in the beginning just like the stacking change in Fiesta recently. It's forgotten or not talked about as time passes by.

    But I do agree with you that the main focus shouldn't be PvP but rather PvE balance.


    We could change all cleric heals to be a nuke and change their buffs to 60mins debuffs, or simply add these are new skills but with tied cooldown to the supporting skills. So the moment you use the nuke, the heals goes on cooldown based on the nuke's cooldown.

    e.g. If nuke has 15s cooldown, then when you use it, the 3s heal will go on cooldown for 15s. How would you feel about that?

    If that were to happen then I'll be okay with clerics being good in PvP.

  • Uhh, I said pretty much none of the things you're seemingly rebutting. You're asking why I do things I never indicated doing, compare a broken mechanic to an intended feature, and in the end you're just rambling things nobody asked for.

    When I say class balance, I mean that in my opinion, pretty much every single class, both their advantages and disadvantages, in Fiesta, are more or less off-balance. Cleric's ability to be offensively useful is a small fragment of that, so is their defense, as you mentioned. I was gonna talk about a concept of a balanced class with versatility here, but considering your reply I somehow feel like I'm shouting in the broken telephone wind.

    Just so we're clear though, I most definitely didn't mean every class should have massive dps, or same fixed defense, or be able to do every single thing every other class can do. Even talking about it is just intentionally muddling the line between equality and all being the same in order to turn arguments ridiculous.

  • 1. The game wasn't originally intended to have trinity. Don't play it so no idea why they decided to add a dedicated support character now. Maybe because the company is notorious for listening to bad player QQ.

    Listening to "bad player" about adding a support class. This is what made me believe you're against the idea of having classes that can't do everything that the other classes can. Moreover, it is hard to say that the game wasn't "intended" to have trinity just because it didn't exist before as the support class fits in perfectly but that's another discussion.



    When I say class balance, I mean that in my opinion, pretty much every single class, both their advantages and disadvantages, in Fiesta, are more or less off-balance. Cleric's ability to be offensively useful is a small fragment of that, so is their defense, as you mentioned. I was gonna talk about a concept of a balanced class with versatility here, but considering your reply I somehow feel like I'm shouting in the broken telephone wind.

    Isn't my previous suggestion about adding nukes and debuffs to clerics constitute a "balanced class with versatility"? Being versatile is to be able to do different things other than just supporting. Also, try using a cell phone instead?


    So, I'm not quite sure what you're disagreeing with.

  • Listening to "bad player" about adding a support class. This is what made me believe you're against the idea of having classes that can't do everything that the other classes can. Moreover, it is hard to say that the game wasn't "intended" to have trinity just because it didn't exist before as the support class fits in perfectly but that's another discussion.


    Isn't my previous suggestion about adding nukes and debuffs to clerics constitute a "balanced class with versatility"? Being versatile is to be able to do different things other than just supporting. Also, try using a cell phone instead?


    So, I'm not quite sure what you're disagreeing with.

    Disagreeing? Where do you get all this from?

    Ah yes, that was a general remark about the company. Nothing wrong with support classes, or classes that can't do everything. No class should. Whole thing about having character variety is exactly that, variety, whether it's class selection or build based. And it's not hard, because it's been one of the main topics around it since before the game was out. Sure it fits, but that doesn't change much.


    I apologize, didn't notice it was a serious suggestion. I guess that's one way to do it, still personally think it should be progressive instead of just popping a skill to switch between heal and dps wherever convenient. How would that help balance between classes, or even within this one class?

  • It would help them in PvE since you don't need the heals or the buffs as a cleric most of the time and just lacking damage. As for between classes balance, I'd imagine it being broken.


    The suggestion sounds silly because that's where we at when it comes to clerics sadly. People wants to keep the class as is but give it more damage.

    Also, what do you mean by progressive? Like slowly making changes to the class or be part of progressing through the game?


    I'd say it's much easier to take a bigger steps even if it breaks the class. As long as the changes comes relatively quickly.

    Like stacking, you go to the extreme and remove it, then you find a middle ground.

  • Sorry to hear that you have lost faith. I would like to ask you the same question: how have we ruined.... what has happened that made you lose interest and/or hope? Is it "just" the glad thing, or is it more?

    Nothing has happened, that's the thing. We gave you so many ideas and so much time to rebalance the game and it is still the same thing.


    The imbalance of this game is crazy. It makes everyone that's not playing the gladiator want to quit. All the high level raids revolve around glads. Everyone else is cast aside.

  • @fox

    now that you bring it up, in the past i've played in teams for various types of raids, dungeons, etc, where we had a chain list of "fall backs"

    fall back means when there's a pre determined sequence of who steps in when the person leading the way either needs a break or falls out for a minute. for that to happen, each member in the team, has to, in their own way according to their class and abilities, be able to take point, or in other words, take over the lead, even if only temporarily.

    if a game really is balanced, then this is possible, if it is grossly out of balance even the most capable player will face points where their ability simply won't be enough to succeed.

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Philzey ().

  • As man who mains glad for 10+ years and participated in many raids/speed runs, I can confirm that gladiator is very unbalanced and broken class.

    This probly was said already, but will summarise anyway:
    1) Passive and Mighty Set are BROKEN. Gladiator can TRIPLE his damage without big efforts.
    2) Slash set. Makes fatal slash drop def of ENEMY by 20%, instead of boosting SKILL EFFECT by 20%.
    3) Heat of Fury, if activated properly, could replace aoes of mages. Not gonna go into details, raiders know the idea.

    I was able to pretty much DUO Temple of Gods being the ONLY gladiator in 7 minuts with crusader. Had 2 charmless mages and HK with us who helped opening gates.
    Can show screen later. And thats result done by scless/skinless player.

    No other class can do as much dmg as good gladiator (not talking about asshanded glads who dont even change set, they are irrelevant).

    One of oldest veterans of game, 2008+.
    Leader of oldest guild alive in game, BandOfTheHawk (2008+).
    Godliest free players alive, 0$ invested.

    Almost full cards collection.
    Author of numerous challenging videos and speed raids, top scorer of many GTs.
    Husband of a goddess.
    Facebook, Youtube, Site.... Find them on your own.

    ---------------

    And what did YOU achieve?

    About time to answer that question.

    -------------
    Discord: Yaseeda#3171